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1 freetoken  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 8:44:02pm

Melanie Phillips? Really? Truly? Honestly???

2 freetoken  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 8:45:07pm
3 CuriousLurker  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 9:53:44pm

re: #1 freetoken

LOL, Encounter Books is a wingnut publisher. From their blog: Ann Barnhardt, Culture Hero

In case anyone doesn't know who Ann Barnhardt is... (Hint: I think she aspires to be Pamela Geller when she grows up.)

4 Flavia  Tue, Nov 8, 2011 9:58:13pm

I'll be the first to say that, yes, there are some real Jew-hating nutjobs at OWS.& I'll also be the first to say that they are probably in direct proportion to the racist nutjobs at Teabagger rallies. Just as representative, too. As in "not."

5 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 7:48:11am

I wonder if Ad Hominem could become as popular a reply as "Magical Balance Fairy", or "Tu quoque".

Thank you for not addressing the issue at all, and only pointing out a negative characteristic or belief of the person supporting it.

It is what I expected.

6 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 7:55:30am

Oh, and the website says Roger Kimball is the President and Publisher of Encounter Books.

Even your link describes Ann Barnhardt only as an intrepid Colorado resident.

Just in case anyone thought from your post that Ann Barnhardt was on the staff at Encounter Books (she is not). However you found a positive mention of someone you disagree with, on their blog, so in your mind that invalidates Melanie Phillips.

I would hate for there to be a misunderstanding.

7 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:27:01am

re: #4 Flavia

I'll be the first to say that, yes, there are some real Jew-hating nutjobs at OWS.& I'll also be the first to say that they are probably in direct proportion to the racist nutjobs at Teabagger rallies. Just as representative, too. As in "not."

Uhm. No.

8 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:43:55am

[Link: blog.occupyjudaism.org...]
[Link: blog.occupyjudaism.org...]

btw, I was amused by skimming through the rwnj hack-hitjobs on "occupy judaism" that I came aross: [Link: frontpagemag.com...] [Link: www.americanthinker.com...]

At least Commentary Magazine was somewhat fair: [Link: www.commentarymagazine.com...]

Some more stuff:
[Link: tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com...]
[Link: tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

Long story short: Not all Jews are Zionists. Not everybody who is not a Zionist is an Anti-zionist. Street lefties will always attract Anti-imperialists, and Anti-imperialists will always have a core of Anti-zionists.

9 Romantic Heretic  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:45:02am

Well, that slur took longer to appear than I thought. Who started it here is no surprise though.

10 CuriousLurker  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:47:13am

From the back cover of David Horowitz's Reforming Our Universities: The Campaign For An Academic Bill Of Rights

"David Horowitz is a national treasure. In his courage, passion, and perseverance he has done more than anyone to expose the rottenness—moral and political as well as intellectual—that has infected the heart of American higher education. In this explosive new book, he adds treatment to diagnosis, providing concrete, workable strategies to achieve what many of us had given up as hopeless: reclaiming the university. This book is essential reading for anyone concerned about the future of American culture."
Roger Kimball, author of Tenured Radicals: How Politics Has Corrupted Our Higher Education

Ann Barnhardt burning a copy of the Qur'an

Ann Barnhardt using slices of bacon as bookmarks for a Qur'an

These are Encounter Books' "heroes".

11 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:51:29am

CL, since I have your attention here (and speaking of "tu quoque" ;-): [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

12 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:54:44am

re: #8 000G

J Street, Tides foundation... You could have just said Soros says it aint true... it would have been easier.

“There is anti-Semitism everywhere in the world, and no more here than anywhere else,” - From one of the TPM links

Why does that not make me feel better? Good, they have just the right amount of anti-Semitism. Imagine someone form the tea party saying something like that.

13 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:56:21am
socialist-Islamist-fascist axis

What the fuck does that mean, Buck?

14 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:58:04am

re: #8 000G

Long story short: Not all Jews are Zionists. Not everybody who is not a Zionist is an Anti-zionist. Street lefties will always attract Anti-imperialists, and Anti-imperialists will always have a core of Anti-zionists.

What do you think a Zionist is? What is your definition of Zionist? You tell us what it is not.... What do you think it is?

15 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:58:20am

re: #12 Buck

J Street, Tides foundation... You could have just said Soros says it aint true... it would have been easier.

Yes, Soros is everywhere. BOOGA BOOGA!!!

“There is anti-Semitism everywhere in the world, and no more here than anywhere else,” - From one of the TPM links

Why does that not make me feel better? Good, they have just the right amount of anti-Semitism. Imagine someone form the tea party saying something like that.

Huh? It would be just as true coming from a Teabagger. Look anywhere in YouTube or Yahoo! News comments.

16 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 8:59:01am

re: #14 Buck

What do you think a Zionist is? What is your definition of Zionist? You tell us what it is not... What do you think it is?

I will tell you right after you told us what you know Herman Cain is guilty of. You still owe us an answer to that one.

17 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:00:58am

re: #16 000G

I will tell you right after you told us what you know Herman Cain is guilty of. You still owe us an answer to that one.

You are mistaken at your core. I don't owe you, or anyone else here anything.

18 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:01:52am

re: #17 Buck

You are mistaken at your core. I don't owe you, or anyone else here anything.

Well, then excuse me for assuming that you were partaking in the common standards of conversational decency. Obviously you are just in for the shits and giggles.

19 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:04:32am

re: #18 000G

Well, then excuse me for assuming that you were partaking in the common standards of conversational decency. Obviously you are just in for the shits and giggles.

In a conversation someone TOLD ME WHAT I WAS THINKING (that Cain was not guilty), and I corrected them. You were not part of that conversation, AND that person was rude and outside of "the common standards of conversational decency" by telling me what I thought.

I asked you a question.

20 CuriousLurker  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:06:06am

Interesting that Buck added a quote by Charles to make it appear as he endorses his video even though he down-dinged it.

In ausdaor's thread he also said:

Oh and I later add that anyone who updinged that bigoted hate speech should be ashamed.

Charles up-dinged that Page. Odd that he openly hurled allegations of bigotry at everyone but Charles. Must've slipped his mind. //

21 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:06:48am

re: #19 Buck

In a conversation someone TOLD ME WHAT I WAS THINKING (that Cain was not guilty), and I corrected them. You were not part of that conversation, AND that person was rude and outside of "the common standards of conversational decency" by telling me what I thought.

I asked you a question.

You stated that you knew what Cain was guilty of.
You were asked what Cain was guilty of, according to you, by several people, in that thread. I am joining them.

What is Cain guilty of, Buck? I will answer your question after you answer this one.

22 CuriousLurker  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:09:18am

re: #11 000G

CL, since I have your attention here (and speaking of "tu quoque" ;-): [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Thank youuuuu! ;o)

23 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:09:28am

re: #20 CuriousLurker

Interesting that Buck added a quote by Charles to make it appear as he endorses his video even though he down-dinged it.

In ausdaor's thread he also said:

Charles up-dinged that Page. Odd that he openly hurled allegations of bigotry at everyone but Charles. Must've slipped his mind. //

I didn't "make it appear as he endorses his video". I was clear that I was trying to be clear that I looked up Melanie Phillips status here. I was using that quote (very clearly) to show what he thought about Melanie Phillips. I even said that he disagreed with her stand on Creationism.

However that opinion on Creationism did not taint her other work. At least in 2009 it didn't seem to.

24 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:11:31am

re: #13 Obdicut

What the fuck does that mean, Buck?

Did you watch the video? Clearly not.

25 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:15:13am

re: #24 Buck

Are you incapable of explaining the phrase on your own?

26 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:19:34am

re: #10 CuriousLurker

These are Encounter Books' "heroes".

You don't like David Horowitz?

27 leftynyc  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:22:35am

re: #17 Buck

You are mistaken at your core. I don't owe you, or anyone else here anything.

Well, that's true enough. Of course, most knew you were full of shit so weren't really expecting you to come through.

28 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:23:01am

re: #25 Obdicut

Are you incapable of explaining the phrase on your own?

Lazy of you, but ok.

The author discusses how socialists, Islamists, and fascist are united in the same fight. A list of groups who are the Axis to the group the author supports (is Allied with).

29 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:23:04am

The video begins with endorsing the ECI hatchet job which was based on 2 or 3 cherrypicked instances not representative of OWS in the least (and which were analyzed over and over in the comments here).

This alone discredits the clip, but it gets much worse, of course. "Godwining" doesn't begin to describe it. Anyone who agrees with the message of this clip is beyond the reach of reason.

30 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:25:47am

re: #28 Buck

Who are the 'socialists'?

Who are the 'fascists'?

31 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:26:33am

Since most of the anti-Islamic parties in Europe are also proto-fascist, I'm having difficulty with this whole "axis" thing.

32 Gus  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:28:50am

Watching the video here. I haven't seen a conspiratorial load of crap since Glenn Beck left Fox News.

33 wrenchwench  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:30:31am

re: #5 Buck

I wonder if Ad Hominem could become as popular a reply as "Magical Balance Fairy", or "Tu quoque".

Thank you for not addressing the issue at all, and only pointing out a negative characteristic or belief of the person supporting it.

It is what I expected.

You have proven your inability to accurately judge your sources. Now I am going to give you my assessment of you as a source:

Buck, you're an idiot.

34 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:31:49am

re: #30 Obdicut

Who are the 'socialists'?

Who are the 'fascists'?

Really? You need me to explain the video to you word by word? Sentence by sentence? That kind of misses the point of linking to the video.

You are perfectly free to disagree with the authors point. It is detailed, and explained in Melanie Phillips new book.

If you have a counter argument, or would like to refute the author you are free to do so. You can ask me to write it out for you, or explain it to you, but that is not going to happen.

35 Gus  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:32:21am

Oh. And here's another one of their videos: Why The Global Warming Agenda Is Wrong. Typical full spectrum right-wing fail.

A debunking of the global warming agenda, from Roy W. Spencer, former NASA climatologist and climate expert. For more on this topic, purchase his new Broadside, "The Bad Science and Bad Policy of Obama's Global Warming Agenda" by clicking here...

Pablum puking wingnuts.

36 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:32:35am

re: #33 wrenchwench

You have proven your inability to accurately judge your sources. Now I am going to give you my assessment of you as a source:

Buck, you're an idiot.

Name Calling.

37 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:33:26am

re: #33 wrenchwench

You have proven your inability to accurately judge your sources. Now I am going to give you my assessment of you as a source:

Buck, you're an idiot.

Now, why are you complimenting him?

38 CuriousLurker  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:34:14am

re: #26 Buck

You don't like David Horowitz?

Why do you care?

39 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:34:24am

re: #35 Gus 802

Oh. And here's another one of their videos: Why The Global Warming Agenda Is Wrong. Typical full spectrum right-wing fail.

Pablum puking wingnuts.

Name calling AND Ad Hominem... a twofer

40 Gus  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:35:10am

And another video/book of theirs:

The EPA's Green Tyranny

The relationship between environmental regulation and economic growth has gone from dysfunctional to disastrous under the leadership of Barack Obama's EPA Administrator Lisa Jackson. Jackson's EPA has assumed broad new powers and promulgated sweeping new regulations unlike anything America has seen since the Clean Air Act and Clean Water Act were signed into law 40 years ago. While much of the public has focused on the EPA's plans to regulate greenhouse-gas emissions, the agency's power grab extends into far more areas of society and the economy than fossil-fuel use alone.

This video explains why Obama's EPA is different and more dangerous than any other since the agency was created. While the tentacles of this EPA are silently creeping into our lives, Lisa Jackson smilingly assures us that everything the EPA does generates revenue -- instead of costing industry billions of dollars and America hundreds of thousands of jobs.

41 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:35:25am

re: #36 Buck

Name Calling.

Name calling is what your video clip does, you nitwit.

42 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:35:38am

re: #34 Buck

Buck, if I linked a video, I would be fully prepared to defend it, argue its points, and explain it to people. I have, in the past, done so.

That you seem to think that by linking the video-- in an obviously approving manner-- you have taken any burden of defending the positions off your own back is weird as hell. Where is the conviction of your position? If you were legitimately trying to convince anyone, wouldn't you want to make the argument, and not passively-aggressively point to the video and say that it's all there?

43 Gus  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:38:20am

re: #41 Sergey Romanov

Name calling is what your video clip does, you nitwit.

Exactly. You beat me to it. Including his own words when he associates some of us with "socialist-Islamist-fascist axis unite around the anti-Semitic banner" -- whatever the heck that means. The other day he ran out of words and was simply saying "that's basically from Stormfront." It's really just a feeble attempt at "poisoning the well." Pure propaganda and fear mongering coming from Buck here. And I would add that he and this video is counterproductive for the cause of identifying real antisemitism. Not this giant broad brush attempt that includes swallowing Obama into the mess.

44 wrenchwench  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:39:42am

re: #36 Buck

Name Calling.

And here I thought you wouldn't get the irony...

45 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:40:44am

re: #42 Obdicut

Buck, if I linked a video, I would be fully prepared to defend it, argue its points, and explain it to people. I have, in the past, done so.

That you seem to think that by linking the video-- in an obviously approving manner-- you have taken any burden of defending the positions off your own back is weird as hell. Where is the conviction of your position? If you were legitimately trying to convince anyone, wouldn't you want to make the argument, and not passively-aggressively point to the video and say that it's all there?

Is that really what I did? You only see a link to a video and nothing else? hmm sometimes you see things that are not there, and in this case fail to see words that are there.

Not sure how asking the most basic questions, like "Who are the 'socialists'?" is making an argument that I should be defending. I think you are ONCE AGAIN asking inane questions.

46 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:40:55am

Wonder what Killgore Trout thinks of this.

47 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:41:44am

re: #43 Gus 802

Or, for that manner, the many Israeli socialists.

48 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:42:24am

re: #45 Buck

That's fine, Buck. You're unwilling or incapable of defending your position.

49 Gus  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:43:44am

Encounter Books

Encounter Books is an American conservative book publisher. It is an activity of Encounter for Culture and Education, Inc. Encounter Books draws its name from Encounter (magazine), the now defunct literary magazine founded by Irving Kristol and Stephen Spender.[1]

Encounter Books publishes serious non-fiction books, with a scholarly leaning, in the areas of history, religion, biography, education, public policy, current affairs, social sciences, and politics.

Encounter Books was founded in 1997 in San Francisco, by Peter Collier. Collier retired in late-2005, and Encounter Books was taken over by the commentator Roger Kimball, who is also co-editor and publisher of The New Criterion. Kimball relocated Encounter Books to New York City in early 2006.

Encounter Books has published many well-known writers, including Brian C. Anderson, Ward Connerly, Theodore Dalrymple, John Fund, Victor Davis Hanson, Peter Hitchens, David Horowitz, Leon Kass, William Kristol, Yuval Levin, Andrew C. McCarthy, Melanie Phillips, David Pryce-Jones, Jean-François Revel, Thomas Sowell, David Stove, and Keith Windschuttle.

Encounter Books is distributed by the Perseus Books Group.

50 jaunte  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:44:01am
"I now find that to find people who are sane and decent and rational, one has to go to people with no education. The most highly educated are now the most irrational, the most bigoted, and the most intolerant. It is in the intelligentsia where this problem is rooted. The core is the repudiation of the very concept of truth and objectivity by this intelligentsia, who have embraced instead everything that is subjective and relative."
-- Melanie Phillips

This is probably not someone who should command an audience among people who think.

51 Gus  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:45:11am

Roger Kimball

Roger Kimball (born 1953) is a conservative U.S. art critic and social commentator. He was educated at Cheverus High School, a Jesuit institution in South Portland, Maine, and then at Bennington College, where he took a BA in philosophy and classical Greek, and Yale University. He first gained prominence in the early 1990s with the publication of his book, Tenured Radicals: How Politics Has Corrupted Higher Education. Additionally, he is editor and publisher of The New Criterion magazine and the publisher of Encounter Books. He currently serves on the board of the Manhattan Institute for Policy Research, the board of Transaction Publishers and as a Visitor of Ralston College, a start-up liberal arts college based in Savannah, Georgia.[1] He also served on the Board of Visitors of St. John's College (Annapolis and Santa Fe). His forthcoming book, The Fortunes of Permanence: Culture and Anarchy in an Age of Amnesia, will be published by St. Augustine's Press in the Spring of 2012.

52 Gus  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:47:21am

re: #47 Obdicut

Or, for that manner, the many Israeli socialists.

Not true! Everyone in Israel thinks the same and they all vote Likud! Anyone that disagrees with that is anti-Israel!

//

53 CuriousLurker  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 9:51:26am

re: #51 Gus 802

Everyone's done a good job of making it clear that Encounter Books is part of Wingnut Central™, so I guess I'm going to get back to work now.

54 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 10:09:39am

re: #53 CuriousLurker

Everyone's done a good job of making it clear that Encounter Books is part of Wingnut Central™, so I guess I'm going to get back to work now.

Clearly for you the description "American conservative book publisher" is equal to "Wingnut Central". That is fine, but it really isn't an argument, or a real point. You can, if you wish, call everyone who is conservative all kinds of names.

In my opinion it says more about you that it does them.

55 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 10:11:35am

re: #54 Buck

Do you think socialist Israeli's are anti-semitic, Buck?

56 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 10:25:28am

re: #55 Obdicut

What's with the apostrophes lately?

57 Obdicut  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 10:30:48am

re: #56 000G

I've gotten too reliant on the editing tool.

58 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 12:17:54pm

re: #54 Buck

Clearly for you the description "American conservative book publisher" is equal to "Wingnut Central". That is fine, but it really isn't an argument, or a real point. You can, if you wish, call everyone who is conservative all kinds of names.

In my opinion it says more about you that it does them.

Don't pretend you're about arguments, Buck. You posted a clip that equated liberals/progressives with socialists, smeared them as allies to fascists and Islamists and called them antisemites and totalitarians - all that without a shred of evidence. If you were about arguments, you would not have posted such Goebbelsian propaganda.

59 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 12:47:40pm

I think that a lot of anarchists, ISM, BDS, Flotillards, Code Pink and other "Anti-Israel" moonbat types are attracted to OWS like ants to a picnic. This doesn't mean OWS supports them but they are a magnet for these turds, just like the Tea Parties are a magnet for White Supremacist, Neo-Confederates.

60 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 12:48:24pm

I support OWS!

61 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 1:10:12pm

re: #46 000G

Wonder what Killgore Trout thinks of this.

Answer: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

62 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 1:36:58pm

re: #61 000G

Answer: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Ya, the answer is very interesting:

Does OWS have a problem with antisemitism? Probably yes but it's unlikely to become central to the movement unless Israel attacks Iran, goes into Gaza again, or the US starts another war that the lefties can blame on Israel. Does that video have a point? No, not really.

So as long as Israel does not defend itself (I am sure no one is suggesting that Israel would attack Iran or Gaza if it wasn't self defence), then the problem with anti semitism that OWS has, is unlikely to be central to the movement.

Kilgore.... THAT DESCRIBES THE POINT. It doesn't have to be central to the movement to be alarming to Jews. That it is there, and percolating to the surface is alarming. That it is there and people are excusing it, and ignoring it is alarming. That is the point.

63 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 1:38:48pm

re: #62 Buck

We have to stop them!

Our souls are in danger!

64 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 1:43:00pm

re: #58 Sergey Romanov

all that without a shred of evidence.

If you really watch it, the video does make the case to support what it saying. You don't really describe what the video is saying properly, but to say there is no argument... well that is simply not true.

I know what a simple screed of name calling looks like, and in my opinion this isn't it.

65 Buck  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 1:46:42pm

re: #63 WindUpBird

We have to stop them!

Our souls are in danger!

In every generation, we read on Pesach, they rise up to oppress us.

I pose a challenge to the indifferent to defend Jewish rights and existence, and not ignore the threat simply because it doesn't seem central.

In every generation, they rise up to oppress us.

To answer what I think you are wondering, Yes I really believe that.

66 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 1:54:38pm

re: #64 Buck

If you really watch it, the video does make the case to support what it saying. You don't really describe what the video is saying properly, but to say there is no argument... well that is simply not true.

I know what a simple screed of name calling looks like, and in my opinion this isn't it.

I watched it and several times at that. It doesn't even come close to making a case.

67 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 1:56:53pm

re: #65 Buck

In every generation, we read on Pesach, they rise up to oppress us.

I pose a challenge to the indifferent to defend Jewish rights and existence, and not ignore the threat simply because it doesn't seem central.

In every generation, they rise up to oppress us.

To answer what I think you are wondering, Yes I really believe that.

stand tall!

68 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 1:57:35pm

THE VALIANT DEFENSE, MOUNTED


THE BLOG, AN ARENA OF SORROWS


THE INTERNETS STAND FAST

69 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 4:35:22pm

socialist-Islamist-fascist axis = GAZE

70 Wozza Matter?  Wed, Nov 9, 2011 4:37:37pm

re: #68 WindUpBird

THE VALIANT DEFENSE, MOUNTED

THE BLOG, AN ARENA OF SORROWS

THE INTERNETS STAND FAST

WOLVERINES!!eleventy


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